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TOPIC: Should I be worried about cracks in a new belt?

Should I be worried about cracks in a new belt? 09 Aug 2017 00:44 #1

  • tdcooper99
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A few weeks back I posted about my idler pulley failure...the tensioning pulley for the belt that drives my raw water pump. I've been having issues with a squealing belt .... hard to tell which one, but I am pretty sure it's the belt I replaced along with that idler pulley when I had my issue. Bought some belt conditioner and gave it a few shots... which solved it temporarily... and I am fairly certain the belt is tensioned correctly. I really don't want the thing strung so tight I could play an Eddie Van Halen guitar solo on it, but it's pretty tight. It does stop squealing once it gets warm... but still doesn't seem right that it squeals at all.

Today... I'm cleaning my bilge and I notice the brand new belt (literally maybe 6 hours on it) has cracks in it. Is this normal? I am starting to wonder if my raw water pump is really putting some strain on that belt? See pic:

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Tyson, Ackerley, Sidney & Gene
Tsawwassen, BC
1996 2858 Ciera Command Bridge
Mercruiser 7.4L BRAVO II (GEN. V) GM 454 V-8; Engine Serial 0F603347
"Island Passport"
Home marina: Point Roberts, WA

Should I be worried about cracks in a new belt? 09 Aug 2017 01:44 #2

  • Pcpete
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That there just isn't right. Finding the cause is a guessing game that would run from a belt that was produced twenty years ago to a bad batch. I would clean the pulley faces where the belt rides then install a new belt and buy a spare. I suggest going back to the newest mercruiser labeled part number. For that you will need the engine serial number and model. Pick your search engine and start with mercruiser parts. Find a site that has the schematics and look up your part. Then you can go shopping at a napa, Canadian tire, etc.
Really clean pulley faces are going to be important.
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Should I be worried about cracks in a new belt? 09 Aug 2017 02:50 #3

  • tdcooper99
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Pcpete wrote: That there just isn't right. Finding the cause is a guessing game that would run from a belt that was produced twenty years ago to a bad batch. I would clean the pulley faces where the belt rides then install a new belt and buy a spare. I suggest going back to the newest mercruiser labeled part number. For that you will need the engine serial number and model. Pick your search engine and start with mercruiser parts. Find a site that has the schematics and look up your part. Then you can go shopping at a napa, Canadian tire, etc.
Really clean pulley faces are going to be important.


Ok, I'll do some pulley cleaning. Batch produced 20 yeasr ago doesn't seem realistic... but the spare I bought at the same time had to be ordered in as they only had one in stock when I needed it so it's more likely to not be old. Maybe I switch to the spare, order 1 more and see what happens.

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Tyson, Ackerley, Sidney & Gene
Tsawwassen, BC
1996 2858 Ciera Command Bridge
Mercruiser 7.4L BRAVO II (GEN. V) GM 454 V-8; Engine Serial 0F603347
"Island Passport"
Home marina: Point Roberts, WA

Should I be worried about cracks in a new belt? 09 Aug 2017 12:59 #4

  • 2850Bounty
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Steer clear of the BBQ Pork V-belts. I would take it in and match it up to a US made V-belt.

Although this is likely not causing the belt issue, I also agree with Pete......, the pulley V faces are rusty and should be cleaned up.

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Rick E. Portland, Oregon
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Should I be worried about cracks in a new belt? 09 Aug 2017 14:03 #5

  • green650
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Switch to a crank driven pump and you won't need that pesky belt anymore. And you'll get rid of the troublesome mercury water pump. Yours should be easy since you're non MPI and have the centering pins on the crank.

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Should I be worried about cracks in a new belt? 09 Aug 2017 16:05 #6

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green650 wrote: Switch to a crank driven pump and you won't need that pesky belt anymore. And you'll get rid of the troublesome mercury seawater pump.


100 X's Ditto and Amen Brother! :)

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Rick E. Portland, Oregon
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Should I be worried about cracks in a new belt? 09 Aug 2017 16:52 #7

  • tdcooper99
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green650 wrote: Switch to a crank driven pump and you won't need that pesky belt anymore. And you'll get rid of the troublesome mercury water pump. Yours should be easy since you're non MPI and have the centering pins on the crank.


So what would drive the fuel pump then? Would I have to switch to an electric fuel pump?

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Tyson, Ackerley, Sidney & Gene
Tsawwassen, BC
1996 2858 Ciera Command Bridge
Mercruiser 7.4L BRAVO II (GEN. V) GM 454 V-8; Engine Serial 0F603347
"Island Passport"
Home marina: Point Roberts, WA

Should I be worried about cracks in a new belt? 09 Aug 2017 18:21 #8

  • Ruffryder
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Pulley surface is about the worst I've seen.
Yes , you will need to convert to an electric fuel pump feeding it through the oil pressure SWITCH per USCG regulation.

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Joon, Kathy, Jaden & Tristan
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Should I be worried about cracks in a new belt? 09 Aug 2017 19:03 #9

  • 2850Bounty
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Clarification ......... the electric feel pump would be powered by a relay that is triggered by a N/O low oil pressure switch.


.

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Should I be worried about cracks in a new belt? 09 Aug 2017 21:48 #10

  • Ruffryder
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Not necessarily...
FYI, NO FUEL PUMP RELAY used for electric fuel pump driven Mercruiser CARBED engines.
One less device that can go wrong.
Rick, we went over this topic a few yrs ago maybe.

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Joon, Kathy, Jaden & Tristan
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Should I be worried about cracks in a new belt? 09 Aug 2017 22:17 #11

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Joon, do as you wish…...... I will always incorporate a relay.
With a relay, the start-by-pass circuit will not be able to pose any potential feedback issues.

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Should I be worried about cracks in a new belt? 09 Aug 2017 22:52 #12

  • green650
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tdcooper99 wrote:

green650 wrote: Switch to a crank driven pump and you won't need that pesky belt anymore. And you'll get rid of the troublesome mercury water pump. Yours should be easy since you're non MPI and have the centering pins on the crank.


So what would drive the fuel pump then? Would I have to switch to an electric fuel pump?

And that's another reason to get rid of that belt driven water pump. The combo water pump/fuel pump is known to leak.
forums.iboats.com/forum/engine-repair-an...uel-pump-maintenance

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Should I be worried about cracks in a new belt? 09 Aug 2017 23:52 #13

  • Ruffryder
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Not as I wish,
That is how high paid Mercruiser engineers designed to be....the start by pass circuit, when it's fed thru the starter solenoid, I do not see any potential feed back issues.

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Joon, Kathy, Jaden & Tristan
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Should I be worried about cracks in a new belt? 10 Aug 2017 02:53 #14

  • builderdude
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Me thinks If the PO's raw water pump/fuel pump is working as it should and his only issue is his cracked/squealing V-belt then he should grind/sand the rust off the pulleys and install a quality V-belt and be on his way ;)
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Dave
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Should I be worried about cracks in a new belt? 10 Aug 2017 04:23 #15

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That is how high paid Mercruiser engineers designed to be.... the start by pass circuit, when it's fed thru the starter solenoid, I do not see any potential feed back issues.

The "start-by-pass" circuit is initiated by the starter motor's solenoid circuit........... it is not fed through the starter solenoid.

LOPS = low oil pressure switch.
N/O = normally open.

OK...... for those of us who don't know and/or may not understand the electric fuel pump and the USCG requirements:

In the event of engine trouble that would disrupt operation..... the fuel supply must stop.... just as it would with a mechanical fuel pump.
We use the absence of Engine Oil Pressure and a N/O LOPS to achieve this.
Engine quits operating..... oil pressure goes to zero..... LOPS contacts open...... fuel pump loses electrical power and quits pumping fuel.
If a fuel line had been severed, a fire may have been averted.

However, in some cases whereby the carburetor bowl may be low on fuel, the N/O LOPS needs to somehow power the fuel pump prior to the engine achieving oil pressure...... correct?
It can not do this while the contacts are open........ correct?

While there is no oil pressure present (i.e., LOPS contacts are still open), the starter motor's solenoid triggering circuit simultaneously and momentarily triggers the relay.
In other words, this circuit circumvents (i.e., by-passes) the "open" contacts within the required N/O LOPS.
It does this only while engaging the starter motor.
This is what we refer to as the "start-by-pass" circuit.

The now momentarily triggered relay then operates the electric fuel pump and brings fuel into the carburetor bowl.
Once the engine starts up, oil pressure is achieved and the N/O LOPS contacts become Closed!
Once these contacts are closed, this circuit then continues to trigger and hold the relay closed causing the fuel pump to continue operating.

It's actually very simple!



And Dave.... you are correct.
Repair the pulley and replace the V-belt and he should be good to go!

.
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Should I be worried about cracks in a new belt? 10 Aug 2017 17:36 #16

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Thanks to all! I've enjoyed reading the debate as well... something to consider if i choose to convert in future. For now I'll stick with what I've got.

So I ordered 2 OEM mercruiser belts yesterday and they arrived already, just need to go pick them up. My plan is to remove the existing belt and throw it as far as I can and watch it sink. Just kidding, I wouldn't pollute the marina like that... I'll just dispose of it the less fun way :P . Once the belt is off, I'll clean up the pulley with a wire brush on my drill and put the new belt on. Hopefully, job done. Hopefully will never need the spare... but have one anyway. Not a cheap belt either! Almost double what I paid for the existing one. But, obviously get what you pay for.

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Tyson, Ackerley, Sidney & Gene
Tsawwassen, BC
1996 2858 Ciera Command Bridge
Mercruiser 7.4L BRAVO II (GEN. V) GM 454 V-8; Engine Serial 0F603347
"Island Passport"
Home marina: Point Roberts, WA

Should I be worried about cracks in a new belt? 10 Aug 2017 18:36 #17

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If you are savvy and have the balls and skill, the pulley can be dressed up dynamically.
This means that with the old belt in place, and with the engine running at idle speed, a file or tool of your choice can be used to gently machine the rust scale away from the exposed portion of the rotating pulley V groove.

Disclaimer and Caution: This can be dangerous and may pose risks of personal injury. DO NOT do this unless you accept the risk.

I've done this for years....... and I still have all of 6 of my fingers! :)

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Should I be worried about cracks in a new belt? 10 Aug 2017 20:18 #18

  • Ruffryder
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NO FUEL PUMP RELAY required! as shown in this pic. No debating about it.
Yes, it's very simple, but why make it more complicated? B)
It is fed through the starter solenoid contact, fed from the "R" ignition terminal(D) or initiated by the starter motor's solenoid?... call it what you want.

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More than enough Volvo' s fuel pump relay problems could've been avoided IMO...
www.google.com/search?client=ms-android-...AKeJcKYy5JRwogmg_2:0

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Should I be worried about cracks in a new belt? 11 Aug 2017 15:18 #19

  • tdcooper99
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2850Bounty wrote: If you are savvy and have the balls and skill, the pulley can be dressed up dynamically.
This means that with the old belt in place, and with the engine running at idle speed, a file or tool of your choice can be used to gently machine the rust scale away from the exposed portion of the rotating pulley V groove.

Disclaimer and Caution: This can be dangerous and may pose risks of personal injury. DO NOT do this unless you accept the risk.

I've done this for years....... and I still have all of 6 of my fingers! :)


Hmmmm.... not sure I could safely do that with the clearance I have. Being so low in the engine compartment, I'd need to be in the bilge to access the exposed surface of the pulley while it runs, with the power steering and alternator belts also spinning off the crank too. No way I could keep clear of those for sure while trying to concentrate on not losing fingers on the water pump pulley :unsure:

Anyway, hopefully tomorrow I can get stuck in and get it done.

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Tyson, Ackerley, Sidney & Gene
Tsawwassen, BC
1996 2858 Ciera Command Bridge
Mercruiser 7.4L BRAVO II (GEN. V) GM 454 V-8; Engine Serial 0F603347
"Island Passport"
Home marina: Point Roberts, WA

Should I be worried about cracks in a new belt? 12 Aug 2017 15:27 #20

  • tdcooper99
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So check this out... changed my belt out yesterday. Polished up the pulley, but it actually wasn't that bad. The interior was pretty good, not really any rust, the rust in the original pic was mostly on the outside edge. But, I polished it up anyway. But look at the state of this "new" belt I took off. The cracks were more or less in every second or 3rd serration all the way around! That would have messed up my day for sure sooner rather than later. FYI, it was an American made AC Delco belt...

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Tyson, Ackerley, Sidney & Gene
Tsawwassen, BC
1996 2858 Ciera Command Bridge
Mercruiser 7.4L BRAVO II (GEN. V) GM 454 V-8; Engine Serial 0F603347
"Island Passport"
Home marina: Point Roberts, WA

Should I be worried about cracks in a new belt? 12 Aug 2017 21:02 #21

  • mr.bent
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Maybe you should look for a shorter belt to avoid bending it backwards in such a small radius

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Should I be worried about cracks in a new belt? 13 Aug 2017 16:27 #22

  • tdcooper99
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mr.bent wrote: Maybe you should look for a shorter belt to avoid bending it backwards in such a small radius


That is an interesting point. When I put the new belt on I did feel that the idler pulley really shouldn't need to be hitched up so high.... but this is the belt size specified by Mercruiser, so who am I to second guess?

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Tyson, Ackerley, Sidney & Gene
Tsawwassen, BC
1996 2858 Ciera Command Bridge
Mercruiser 7.4L BRAVO II (GEN. V) GM 454 V-8; Engine Serial 0F603347
"Island Passport"
Home marina: Point Roberts, WA

Should I be worried about cracks in a new belt? 14 Aug 2017 02:45 #23

  • builderdude
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tdcooper99 wrote: it actually wasn't that bad. The interior was pretty good, not really any rust, the rust in the original pic was mostly on the outside edge. But, I polished it up anyway.

"The edge" or inner side edges both of them are the surfaces the belt rides on or is driven from.

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Dave
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www.baylinerownersclub.org/index.php/for...ansom-repair-my-2556
Last Edit: by builderdude.

Should I be worried about cracks in a new belt? 14 Aug 2017 07:28 #24

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Look at your alt. belt.

Alt. could be locking up.

Pulleys are not marine specific.

Oh you should really pressure test your fuel tank they last around 20 years.

Just sayin ...

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