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TOPIC: 2013 element, another with water where it shouldn't be

2013 element, another with water where it shouldn't be 01 Aug 2016 17:50 #26

  • jeffspalmcoast
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2016 Element 16 ft W/75hp

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2016 Element 16' Merc 75 Hp OB
2003 Four Winns 190 220hp Volvo Penta I/O
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2013 element, another with water where it shouldn't be 01 Aug 2016 18:03 #27

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nicker22 wrote: I Don't understand what you mean when you say drains installed? IF there is water in the transom and the wood is wet its too late. A drain may in fact drain the water but the wood will rot . The problem is why is water getting in there in the first place......it shouldn't be there. Once in the damage is done its too late.


I think member Element_Dan shed some light on this issue as well in his June 2016 post address this situation (see below):

Element_Dan - "Okay, I talked with both Bayliner Support andMarina today about the two issues I have.

1st - Water in Sponson area. BL realizes water is getting in there but don't seem overly concerned. The tech stated there is absolutely very little wood used in the Element and the wood used is Greenwood which is a pressure treated wood made for marine use and very resistant to rotting even if exposed to water. He noted dealers, when working with Bayliner Customer Support, will install drains on each Sponson if customer is seeing water there and/or concerned with it. This is not a big deal to me to have extra plugs, I was more worried about exposed wood in these areas. Tech support ensured there is no worry of that, any wood in there is Greenwood and covered with Fiberglass.

2nd- Cracks on the deck. BL realizes this is happening on some boats and tech stated it was from gel-coat that may be applier too thick and cause cracks as it cures. Again, tech was not concerned about it structurally and noted dealer will sand and re-apply jell coat in areas of crack. Again, stated that boat is 95 % fiberglass and not worry about wood that is boat. The only wood is used for bracing and that it coated.

3rd - Water in the Gas Tank area. BL knows about this, but really don't have fix other than you will need to vacuum out if water gets in there. Yes, bit of a pain but no big deal. Their hands are tied since this is portable tank and concerns of gas getting in there if customers fill while still in boat.

Although I'm not overly happy about the issues, they were very upfront and willing to help fix issues under warranty. I've documented everything of course in-case I keep boat for years and this causes issue in future. They did remind the boat structure and hull have lifetime warranty.

Just wanted to update everyone. I really do love this boat other than the couple oddities mentioned. I can't find similar boat this size (need to fit in my garage) and has this much room along with being able to pull skiers for under 20K."

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2016 75hp Element 160 w/ Smart Tabs & Sponson Drains
Last Edit: by TigerBoat.

2013 element, another with water where it shouldn't be 01 Aug 2016 21:51 #28

  • Waking Memories
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Not just limited to the element. My 185 was filled with water on both sides and have heard others with 185 boats also have the pissing water when they drill for tabs or fish finder brackets. I think this is a large problem and only those few that dare to drill their own holes in the hull to mount something find what probably many have but just do not know it.

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2012 185 4.3l
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2013 element, another with water where it shouldn't be 02 Aug 2016 00:39 #29

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Waking Memories wrote: Not just limited to the element. My 185 was filled with water on both sides and have heard others with 185 boats also have the pissing water when they drill for tabs or fish finder brackets. I think this is a large problem and only those few that dare to drill their own holes in the hull to mount something find what probably many have but just do not know it.


Well, +1 for me when I drilled the holes for my Smart Tabs. Only on 1 side, and only about 2-3 ounces out of 1 hole. Short of ripping the whole transom apart, I didn't see much that could be done about it. I dried it up as best I could, and finished the installation. I periodically knock on the transom near the bottom, listening for the dreaded thud, but thankfully it all sounds solid. The boat is 13 years old now, I figure it should be okay so I don't obsess over it, anymore at least.

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Jim
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2013 element, another with water where it shouldn't be 06 Aug 2016 03:49 #30

  • NL-Element
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2014 Element 160

I had about a litre drain from one sponson and a few drops out of the other. Contacted my dealer and apparently Bayliner has a couple idea's of where the water is getting in, they are going to install two drains and find the area where the water is getting in. When I bring my boat in this week for the warranty work I will be asking questions on where Bayliner figures the water is getting in through, and how they will fix it.
Bayliner has been excellent to deal with on a couple of issues now.

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2013 element, another with water where it shouldn't be 06 Aug 2016 19:41 #31

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NL-Element wrote: 2014 Element 160

I had about a litre drain from one sponson and a few drops out of the other. Contacted my dealer and apparently Bayliner has a couple idea's of where the water is getting in, they are going to install two drains and find the area where the water is getting in. When I bring my boat in this week for the warranty work I will be asking questions on where Bayliner figures the water is getting in through, and how they will fix it.
Bayliner has been excellent to deal with on a couple of issues now.


Mine is in the shop right now. Should be ready this week. The dealer is short one drain plug. I asked to be there when they drill the holes. However, they said that, due to insurance, that I would not be allowed to be in the shop while they drill the holes. They said that they would let me know how much water would drain out.
Keep us posted as to where the water is entering. Letting the water escape is one thing. How it's getting in is an other thing.

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Parry Sound, Ontario Canada
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2013 element, another with water where it shouldn't be 18 Aug 2016 00:52 #32

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First post:
Several weeks ago I looked at a 16ft Element at a local boat dealer. Out the door price was a hair over $20k. I'm cheap so went looking for used and found and bought a 2013 Element for $9k. While at the boat dealer I specifically asked whether there was any wood used in the boat and the answer was NO, Bayliner hasn't used any wood in boats for quite a few years. Now I find out via this forum that this is not true, plus water is getting into the sponson areas of the boat and wood in the transom area of the boat may be getting wet. I rather not drill any holes, but on the other hand its not like I've never drilled holes in other boat transoms to mount transducers. I wonder what the Bayliner dealer will say if I told them I just drilled some holes in the boat to see if water leaked out and water did leak out of the sponson area.

Current boats - 2013 Bayliner Element with 60hp Bigfoot
1976 Totally restored Montgomery Ward Sea King, 12ft Al V-hull with 2013 6hp Tohatsu
Just Sold - 2006 Sea Doo Sportster with 215hp Super Charged/Intercooled engine

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2013 element, another with water where it shouldn't be 18 Aug 2016 17:40 #33

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Jimh wrote: I wonder what the Bayliner dealer will say if I told them I just drilled some holes in the boat to see if water leaked out and water did leak out of the sponson area.


I suspect the dealer will say "Well jeez, I've never heard of that before. Let's talk with Bayliner service about that."

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2016 75hp Element 160 w/ Smart Tabs & Sponson Drains

2013 element, another with water where it shouldn't be 18 Aug 2016 17:55 #34

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If you find water, go directly to Bayliner. They will instruct your dealer to install the drain plugs, without charge.
I just got mine back.they did not find water in my 2014 16' Bigfoot during the drain installation.

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Parry Sound, Ontario Canada
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2013 element, another with water where it shouldn't be 29 Aug 2016 14:32 #35

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Got my Element back on Saturday after almost a month at the dealer.

Bayliner installed 2 new drains on each sponsoon , i am not surprised, they said the same thing as others, no indication of where the water was coming from, told me again the hull has a lifetime warranty. Took it out on the river on Sunday , still having problems getting to plane so going to put the smart tabs on this week for next weekend.

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2013 element, another with water where it shouldn't be 29 Aug 2016 16:53 #36

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Noxian wrote: Bayliner installed 2 new drains on each sponsoon.


I hope not :silly:

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2016 75hp Element 160 w/ Smart Tabs & Sponson Drains

2013 element, another with water where it shouldn't be 29 Aug 2016 18:54 #37

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ok one on each :D

Getting my tools together to put my smart tabs on this afternoon.

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2013 element, another with water where it shouldn't be 29 Aug 2016 22:35 #38

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Taking the boat back to the dealer, still water in the hull, new drains not working, not happy, :angry:

Took the boat out yesterday, wouldn't plane on calm water, never used to have problems when I bought it the first year. I think there is more water stuck in the hull that cant get out.

Drilled another hole for my smart tabs and more water came out but the drain plug was already out for over 24hrs...

Also noticed the hole for the drain goes through bare wood no plastic like the original factory one, that cant be good for the life of the hull.

Spent my summer messing around with this boat trying to get it sorted out, sat at the dealer for a month. Now our summer is almost over and I haven't had a single run on my boat without problems. Was even supposed to go camping with it, instead it was sitting at the dealership.

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2013 element, another with water where it shouldn't be 30 Aug 2016 16:32 #39

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Noxian wrote: Taking the boat back to the dealer, still water in the hull, new drains not working, not happy, :angry:

Took the boat out yesterday, wouldn't plane on calm water, never used to have problems when I bought it the first year. I think there is more water stuck in the hull that cant get out.

Drilled another hole for my smart tabs and more water came out but the drain plug was already out for over 24hrs..


Now that is pretty interesting.

Additional pics?

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2016 75hp Element 160 w/ Smart Tabs & Sponson Drains
Last Edit: by TigerBoat.

2013 element, another with water where it shouldn't be 30 Aug 2016 17:07 #40

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Just a question, they drill holes to install 'drain plugs' are they sealing the raw wood as well as the screw holes???? :whistle:

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2013 element, another with water where it shouldn't be 30 Aug 2016 17:07 #41

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No pictures, took it right back to the dealer where it sits now, on hold with bayliner right now.
The following user(s) said Thank You: TigerBoat

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2013 element, another with water where it shouldn't be 30 Aug 2016 17:42 #42

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Noxian wrote: No pictures, took it right back to the dealer where it sits now, on hold with bayliner right now.


Keep up the good work. I believe a lot of folks are interested in the outcome of this one

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2016 75hp Element 160 w/ Smart Tabs & Sponson Drains

2013 element, another with water where it shouldn't be 30 Aug 2016 19:23 #43

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Hi Matt (download complete)

Have you heard anything back from Bayliner?
I find it hard to believe they don't know how and where the water is getting in.

Cheers
Jasperdog

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2013 element, another with water where it shouldn't be 31 Aug 2016 03:32 #44

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So what good is installing more drain holes? It has to be determined how the water is getting into the transom, not draining it from the bilge(s). If the original problem is not fixed, more drain holes will only delay the inevitable. If this is what Bayliner calls a "winner", I'd hate to see a lemon. By the way, I'm a Bayliner fan, but they seem to have a real problem here.

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2013 element, another with water where it shouldn't be 01 Sep 2016 14:22 #45

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Spoke to Bayliner Tuesday they came up with every excuse in the book as to why the boat is fine and I have nothing to worry about. Not impressed

Bayliner said they were going to contact the dealer, Called the dealer twice yesterday got voicemail no response no call backs.

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2013 element, another with water where it shouldn't be 01 Sep 2016 20:16 #46

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So far Bayliner has been pretty good at installing the sponson drain plugs on a case by case decision.
However, they will not tell any of us WHY or WHERE the water is entering the Element boats.
Does anybody on this blog have any contacts at Brunswick that will answer this simple question.
I can see a dramatic lost of sales if the press ever got a hold of this refusal to answer the question by Brunswick/Bayliner.
Calm the seas now. Tell us why some have water entering a water-proof area of the Element and what is being done to correct the issue. The sooner Bayliner comes clean the less bad press and lost sales.

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2013 element, another with water where it shouldn't be 02 Sep 2016 01:15 #47

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Agreed Oakplank! I can see "Lemon Law" settlements all over this thing especially the owners who have had the alleged "fix" by adding additional drain plug in the hull and yet are still getting water elsewhere in the boat. I think I read here someone losing performance and thinking it might be because of water saturating the interior of the hull, foam, stringers whatever....

They should just as in the auto industry have a "voluntary recall" yes it hurts, but at least they are "out in front" of this issue which in my book would really make Bayliner a stand up company. I know ford had a problem with the 2015 edge SUVs leaking water into the cabin floor. They even had a DO NOT SELL to the dealers for a while. And if you were one who had the issue and they determined that you did I fact have that issue, they bought back the car. Most people for another one and stayed loyal to ford in the end. Some customers were lost however but ford stepped up, admitted an issue and did as best they could to resolve. Having "no comment" whatsoever is probably worse than admitting a defect.

Time will tell on this one and it will be interesting...

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2013 element, another with water where it shouldn't be 02 Sep 2016 13:25 #48

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Noxian wrote: Spoke to Bayliner Tuesday they came up with every excuse in the book as to why the boat is fine and I have nothing to worry about. Not impressed

Bayliner said they were going to contact the dealer, Called the dealer twice yesterday got voicemail no response no call backs.


You stated previously that the boat will no longer plane (post 38) . A Bayliner representative told you that this is fine and you have nothing to worry about?

That seems a bit odd :huh:

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2016 75hp Element 160 w/ Smart Tabs & Sponson Drains
Last Edit: by TigerBoat.

2013 element, another with water where it shouldn't be 02 Sep 2016 22:40 #49

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Yup now the tech thinks yes the extra water and possibly water damaged wood or fiberglass could be causing my planing problems , apparently bayliner is going to go so far as to remove the transom if they have to to fix the boat. I am not very happy about that,

Right now the dealer is removing everything including the motor and resealing everything and then water testing it.

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2013 element, another with water where it shouldn't be 04 Sep 2016 12:52 #50

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Noxian wrote: Yup now the tech thinks yes the extra water and possibly water damaged wood or fiberglass could be causing my planing problems , apparently bayliner is going to go so far as to remove the transom if they have to to fix the boat. I am not very happy about that,

Right now the dealer is removing everything including the motor and resealing everything and then water testing it.


I would have them weigh the boat after it is stripped and then try to compare against a new with whatever the same hardware is still on it. This may help in determining if anything water is being retained.

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